Speaker 1 00:00:04 Hello and welcome to a Wonder Care podcast with me, Sheena Mitchell, pharmacist and mom, as always, I'm here to give you lots of family health advice and today we are doing something very special because we are just taking a little week out in between season three and season four. So season four will start next week. But this week myself and a little friend of mine decided that we'd like to raise some awareness about something that has been bothering us lately in a very, very unusual move for me. I have invited a guest onto the podcast from my own family. As a lot of you know, I'm really, really private and I don't share my children on my social media or give away too much about their personal lives. However, my eldest daughter is 11 years old and we felt after a recent experience of dining out with celiac disease that she is now old enough to represent herself and her feelings. Speaker 1 00:01:02 So for a bit of context, I think it's important to know that there are 400,000 people in Ireland living with some form of gluten intolerance. More than 50,000 of these have confirmed celiac disease. Celiac disease is a lifelong autoimmune condition for which there is no treatment other than a strict gluten-free diet. So yes, for some people living gluten-free is a choice and they do it for their own personal reasons, but for others it's a medical necessity. And today we hope to explain to you exactly what that means in real life. Today we're reaching out to every restaurant and food establishment in Ireland to help them to understand the impact of celiac life on a family, whether it's one family member who has celiac disease or the whole family, the Celiac Society for Ireland offer crossed grain certification and they also allow you to sign up to the gluten, gluten-free eating out pledge for restaurants. Speaker 1 00:02:04 I'd really, really encourage all restaurants to visit the Celiac Society of Ireland website and register and complete the actionable training and digital certification. It's so, so important that Celiac received the same consideration and quality of service during menu designing, et cetera. You're happy to do it for vegans, why not do it for celiac? I'll talk a bit more about the benefits to your business. I am a businesswoman after all, so I'm not unaware of how difficult this is and how hard it can be to implement in real life. And we'll talk a little bit more about that in a minute. But for now, without further ado, I'd like to introduce you to my daughter Ila. Hi Ila. Hi <laugh>. Thank you very very much for joining me on the podcast today. Thanks for having me. You're very welcome. So just for a little bit of context, for those who are listening, what age were you when you were first diagnosed with celiac disease? Speaker 2 00:03:00 I was seven years old when I was first diagnosed with celiac Speaker 1 00:03:03 Disease. Did anything happen to you when you ate gluten products like bread or flour, anything containing flour, like normal pasta before you were diagnosed? Speaker 2 00:03:12 No. Like not at all? Mm. Speaker 1 00:03:14 How did you end up getting diagnosed Speaker 2 00:03:16 So ever to that that you might have celiac? We have to get their whole, everyone in the family checked to see if they had celiac disease since it was a possibility. So we all went out to get blood tests and everyone did it. Nearly everyone did it. Speaker 1 00:03:31 <laugh> don't be forgiven week. No, the family politics <laugh> Speaker 2 00:03:35 A couple weeks later we got their results back and my buds were high. Yeah. So then we had to, I had to go get a scope which is like Speaker 1 00:03:43 Run. Speaker 2 00:03:44 Yeah, <laugh> is not not nice. And so we went, we were at the hospital and like all of that, we get the results a couple weeks later and um, CEL, Speaker 1 00:03:54 That was it. So your bloods were absolutely through the roof and we went into the TAH system with a really, really kind doctor. They're all lovely there, aren't they? It was nothing to be scared of. And you did the scope and your vili. So these for the listener just explain are like tiny little hairs that stand up and they're all over your stomach lining. And if you don't have those, you can't actually absorb the minerals and nutrients from your food. So when you're celiac and you've been eating gluten, all of those little vili flatten and that's damage in your stomach and that means that you're not absorbing your food properly. So the only way to get those vili standing up again is ILA Speaker 2 00:04:40 To gluten diet. Speaker 1 00:04:41 Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And that's exactly what we did. Been doing that for three or four years now and we've managed really well. You've been amazing, I have to say credit where it's due and you went to every effort to actually really understand your celiac disease properly. I think that helped. Speaker 2 00:04:59 Yeah, because like I had no idea that it even existed before I, I was diagnosed and that's what we wanna try to spread around today. Speaker 1 00:05:07 Okay. So we're a normal family and it was, what day was it? Very important day. Speaker 2 00:05:12 Mother's Speaker 1 00:05:13 Day, Uhhuh <affirmative>. So we said, you know what, we're not gonna cook. No, we're gonna go out, I'll let you tell the story. Speaker 2 00:05:20 So for Mother's Day we went out to a restaurant and we sat down at our table and we looked at the menu, we asked what they could do gluten free. They said that the chicken wings and the sausages and mash for gluten free, I ordered the chicken wings but they were very spicy. So I decided to order the sausages and mash instead. They were actually really nice <laugh>. But then we had our dessert and you know, we left the restaurant and we came back home. And then about two hours later me and you were shopping for clothes online and I felt a bit sick. So I went into the bathroom, bathroom. Then I felt a bit worse. So I called you to come in and then I threw up and it was for a good one hour for a or so on. Speaker 1 00:06:04 Yeah. And it was awful wasn't it? Because we were vomiting a lot. Yeah. And we did have this experience a couple of times before. Yeah. Weirdly only, but Speaker 2 00:06:15 It's, it's only recently <laugh>. Yeah. So it's like my body's only got used to the debt and it's like now it's all picky like no I'm not having that Speaker 1 00:06:22 Now. Yeah, exactly. It's like we've spent whatever, three or four years being really strict on our gluten-free and done really well. You've done brilliantly And I think your villa I have fully recovered. So now if there is even a crumb of gluten anywhere near your stomach, you're gonna hurl <laugh> a lot. Speaker 2 00:06:43 Yeah. But like if it doesn't even happen straight away, it's not like 10 minutes later it's like a good two hours, three hours later. Speaker 1 00:06:51 Yeah. And then once it starts, it doesn't stop until every single thing is gone. I do stomach. Speaker 2 00:06:57 Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes it even just, it actually just keep going because all the gluten say is gone, but it's like oh my god, there's all this tiny crume left. We've gotta get Speaker 1 00:07:06 That out. And that's really hard because you get tired and you're there like let's, you know it's not, I'm not full asleep. It's not a glamorous subject, but you're basically trying to kneel over a toilet And just the logistics which are really important for like restaurant and cafe owners, owners to hear is that I know you're 11 and you're a big girl, but you're still a child ala. Yeah. And you're not fully grown. And in reality this means you know, you need help to even hold you over the toilet because you became so weak. Vomiting. Yeah. You're shaking like it's horrible. How does that make you feel? Speaker 2 00:07:40 It makes me feel like really, really sore and I'm really like upset. I'm, I'm not very angry. I'm kind of too tired to be angry. So it's more I'm just like, my stomach is sore and I'm frustrated and I'm upset but I'm tired. Speaker 1 00:07:54 Yeah. It's not nice. Yeah. And that is the reality. So look in that situation, we don't know, we obviously rang the restaurant and spoke to them and they were exceptionally sorry and we're not sure were the sausage just even gluten free. But there is actually a possibility, and this is important for restaurants to understand that sausages that are cooked in oil in a fryer that has been say cooking chicken guan or other non-Latin free food, that oil is contaminated and that is enough. Speaker 2 00:08:32 Another one to watch out with that is when you're cooking the chips or whatever. So they said the chips aren't gluten free. But then if the chips weren't gluten free because they were cooked in the same oil, why would the sausages be gluten free? Cuz they were cooked Speaker 1 00:08:46 In the same oil. That's a good point. We missed out on that one really, didn't we? I think we maybe hoped they were gonna grill the sausages or something. Yeah. And that's actually another easy thing that restaurants could fix. Nothing makes Isla smile more than hearing that the chips are cooked in their own oil for just chips <laugh>. Cause it means she can have them because chips themselves are gluten free. But if they're cooked with any other food in the same oil that has gluten in it, they're not gluten free anymore And you're not a great one Now for the mash and ve like you're great at eating vegetables at home and everything, but when you're out you want to be a kid and you see your brother and I Speaker 2 00:09:22 Want burgers like Speaker 1 00:09:22 <laugh>. Yeah Speaker 2 00:09:23 <laugh> give me pizza Speaker 1 00:09:25 <laugh>. You see your brother and sister having like nuggets of chip Speaker 2 00:09:28 Dessert, they're having like these giant chocolate brownies and I'm like me with my fruit bowl of salad. I'm like Speaker 1 00:09:33 Okay, I would like to highlight that she has never once eaten the fruiter Speaker 2 00:09:37 <laugh>. No, no I, there was this one time when I had like there's one time, one time I had <inaudible> one time and they had like the triple chocolate brownies and I Speaker 1 00:09:46 Was like I hate you <laugh>. Speaker 2 00:09:48 Yeah. Like Speaker 1 00:09:49 Yeah, no you got a very raw deal. You do. One thing you said there just really struck me like you're not angry. This is the whole point of what we're trying to say today. We're Speaker 2 00:10:01 Not angry, we're just frustrated and we're a bit, we're Speaker 1 00:10:03 Upset. Yeah we're upset because we'd actually rather hear when we went in Speaker 2 00:10:07 That oh we can't serve you anything gluten free. They're than saying that it is gluten free and not blaming anyone. But I'd prefer them say, I don't know, this is gluten free. So just to be on the safe side cause I'd bring my own pack lunch so that I wouldn't have to Speaker 1 00:10:24 Yeah and we've done that. We have choices. Yeah. So as a family we have either gone to different restaurants and that would be our preferred choice. Yeah. So that everyone can eat off the menu. If we're somewhere and we're like, we really can't guarantee a safe meal for you, we'll cook a pizza just before we go a gluten-free pizza. And I think we should give a shout out to Goodfellas here Isla, because you are obsessed. Speaker 2 00:10:47 They're pizza suck. Speaker 1 00:10:49 <laugh> <laugh>, they too a brilliant gluten-free pizza. And that would be something that would be really easy to stick in your freezer. Restaurants. We're looking for a margarita or a pepperoni. Speaker 2 00:10:58 Yeah. Mm-hmm Speaker 1 00:10:59 <affirmative> either way. So we'll sometimes bring that and there are some places you go that you wouldn't even trust them to heat it up quite frankly. So yeah. Like you've eaten a cold. Right. So before we go on to talk to the restaurants a little bit more about what they need to do, I just wanted to I suppose highlight that this isn't fussy eating for you and to make sure people understand that there are a few scenarios that you live with day-to-day and I'd like you just to explain what you have to think about on a day-to-day basis as a celiac. And don't get us wrong by no way or means are we saying that you know, celiac disease is worse than other illnesses? Yeah. We get that people who are diabetic out there injecting themselves Speaker 2 00:11:50 Are not allergies where you actually die feet Speaker 1 00:11:52 Nuts. Yeah, we know we're not the worst off. Yeah. So islet, tell me about school. So basically you have to bring your own treats to school. Let's start here. Yeah, give them to the teacher. So you manage in school. Okay. Speaker 2 00:12:03 Yeah, but sometimes I have no idea that it's happening. Like most times I'm packing Tuesday we know what's happening and I like had no idea it was fun cake Tuesday. So I normally have a pancake in my lunch or whatever and then I can just do the toppings. But um, this year, because Speaker 1 00:12:19 I'm a bad mother, no Speaker 2 00:12:21 <laugh> because we just forgot we were all like, so it was a long week. It had only been Monday, we were exhausted <laugh>. Um, so we kind of forgot it was pancake Tuesday and then our teacher handed out pancakes and I couldn't eat them so I was sitting there with my sandwich when everyone was like, oh my god, this pancake is so good. I'm like please stop Speaker 1 00:12:44 <laugh> not fun. Okay. So like I'm just gonna say clearly I'm not gonna win a parent of the year award after <laugh> story. But in general we remember <laugh> next up you go to a birthday party, what happens at birthday parties in general? Speaker 2 00:13:04 So I usually have to bring my own food, like if I have to bring like a brownie or I have to bring half pizza or whatever, but I don't normally mine cuz to be honest, I think gluten-free I most of the time better than birthday cake. So come mommy Speaker 1 00:13:17 Me. But it's one of those things you have to think about. Yeah. Yeah. You have to always be prepared. Speaker 2 00:13:22 And I remember this one time my friend had a gluten-free cake but especially just so that I could eat it as well. That was so nice. Speaker 1 00:13:32 Some people are amazing. Yeah. And very lovely. All these little gestures make a big difference in the life of a CBF child Speaker 2 00:13:39 Being able to eat the same as everyone else as well. It's just really nice. So you're not like the odd one out or whatever. Speaker 1 00:13:44 Yeah, as a kid that's important. It's kind of the same thing on play dates as well really isn't it? Speaker 2 00:13:50 I'm just always bringing snacks or something to eat and sometimes my friends buy gluten free treats especially so I'm not left out and I'm always so grateful when they do that. Speaker 1 00:14:00 And you've got some lovely friends whose parents actually will text us to say Speaker 2 00:14:05 Where can Ila eat or are these gluten free? So she can have Speaker 1 00:14:09 Them and they'll go to a restaurant especially cuz you can eat there. Yeah, yeah. It's so nice and it's so nice that you have that supportive network. And one other time that's really annoying is Halloween. Speaker 2 00:14:19 I don't normally mind Halloween to be honest. <laugh> and I'll tell you the reason why. So on Halloween I just go trick or feeding like everyone else just trying to get the most sweet as I can because when we come home we sort them into pot, into balls of gluten free or non-g glutenin free. And if I'm not really sure we'd like to Google it or just pop it in the ball for non glutenin free anyway. And we leave the non-G glutton free ball and we put it outside my room or outside our fairy door or whatever And during the night the switch switch comes and she switches all the gallus in candy for gluten-free candy. And I remember the first year we did it, we had put crunchies in and she said and she had written a note as well and said it's actually okay crunchies are gluten free. And we're like Oh hey Speaker 1 00:15:03 I love crunchies. So basically you're still going round hauling the same amount of glute Yeah. <laugh>. Yeah. Okay. So then there's the element of I suppose how we prepare our food at home and I suppose explaining that to people when we go to people's houses because people can think I bought gluten-free bread, here you go while I made you a sandwich. And even the thought of that actually just makes my skin crawl now because even if the bread's gluten-free. Yeah, what tends to happen? Speaker 2 00:15:31 Well if you toast it or if you're spreading butter on Speaker 1 00:15:34 It, explain that to people. Speaker 2 00:15:36 If you're toasting gluten free bread in a toaster that you toast all the normal bread as well. It's cross contaminated because the crumbs from the bread in the toaster get on the gluten free bread and then the non gluten free CREs around the gluten-free bread. And then you just have gluten-free bread with crumbs on that aren't Speaker 1 00:15:55 Gluten free. And then the next step you take it out And what do people put it down on? Where do they put the bread? Speaker 2 00:16:00 They are chopping board. Speaker 1 00:16:01 So tell me about the breadboard. Speaker 2 00:16:03 Um, so if you have a plastic plate or a breadboard when you actually are cutting something on it, like if you knife um, like makes a scrape on it, all the crumbs can actually get stuck in the scrape that you made and they get stuck there. It's the same with the breadboard and shopping boards as well. So it's like the crumbs or the tiny, Speaker 1 00:16:22 Tiny, tiny, tiny gluten parts Speaker 2 00:16:24 Comes. Yeah. Yeah. They can get stuck And then when say for example I go to eat my gluten-free meal and I press down on the grape that's making all the tiny gluten molecules come onto whatever food I mean Speaker 1 00:16:37 Yeah. And just to be really clear with people, this is not a hygiene issue. You can scrub those chopping boards, bread boards, plastic plates as much as you like. It will not remove the gluten from those little tiny, tiny porous crevices. Speaker 2 00:16:52 We use glass lights or Adele lights and for chopping boards whenever we have, we have our own special gluten-free chopping board that's only used for gluten-free. Like for fruit or for gluten-free bread or for gluten-free cake. Yeah. And the same with pans as well. Speaker 1 00:17:05 Yeah, the frying pans. Yeah. This is where it's kind of confusing sauce pans, any stainless steel absolutely fine, they can be cleaned with hot soapy water and that's fine. Yep. But for a nonstick frying pan as Isla said there, it's the same thing. Yeah. So you need to have your own frying pan. It's not too much tasker, <laugh> <laugh> Speaker 2 00:17:25 For the butter as well. Speaker 1 00:17:27 The butter is a big one. You're right. Gone. Speaker 2 00:17:29 Yeah. This is for any like thing you spread for the knife after dipping in a like jar tub or whatever, if you've got non gluten free bread and you're just spreading and you put your knife in the bar and you spread it, then you go back in cuz you need a bit more butter, then the crumbs come off the knife and into the butter. So then when I go to take a scoop of butter with a knife knife spread it on mine, the crumbs are going from the butter onto my bread and then we've basically got bread with gluten crumbs on it again. Speaker 1 00:17:56 Mm-hmm <affirmative>, what do we do about that in our Speaker 2 00:17:58 House? So I have my own butter and, Speaker 1 00:18:01 And it's funny, when people come to the house we're like don't juice that Speaker 2 00:18:05 Butter. Yeah. If anyone's ever like staying at our house or something but like we're and they're just like spreading their toast. I'm like wait, which better than there is. They're like the golden black one. I'm like, oh well everyone who eats gluten bread got like two pots of Speaker 1 00:18:19 Butter now and you're like no I've got nan. And actually to be fair to your younger brother and sister, they're so good. Speaker 2 00:18:26 They're so good with um, Speaker 1 00:18:28 Cross-contamination. Speaker 2 00:18:29 We had the fruit bowl today and Speaker 1 00:18:31 Oh sorry Ila saying I cut up a load of fruit Yeah. And pulled it on the table. Speaker 2 00:18:34 Yeah. And my brother was like Yay. And he went out six food and and my sister was like, oh wait, maybe we I ila take it first since you've been touching your sandwich and then you were like, great job. Speaker 1 00:18:49 Yeah. It's because they care so much and like they've seen you being sick and no, sorry, I'm not like they're not in with the popcorn watch <laugh>. Speaker 2 00:18:58 They're like they know what I'm doing. Speaker 1 00:19:00 Yeah. And like it's happened at times say where daddy isn't here and we're on our own and Speaker 2 00:19:04 Like, and they're like, mommy, Speaker 1 00:19:06 Mommy, mommy you said your pass to bed two hours ago. And I'm like no. Yeah, no Speaker 2 00:19:11 They're allowed to do that perfectly. Like that's what they'd normally do and that's fine but your sister's kinda Speaker 1 00:19:16 We're busy and no you're not getting a story because we'll probably be here for another hour <laugh>. But anyway, I think that was just important to explain to people what we do subconsciously on a day-to-day basis. Yeah. To manage your celiac disease and thank you Isla for explaining that for people because I think it's important that people realize how much you have to self-manage. Speaker 2 00:19:39 Yeah. If you're go eat out, you just have to really keep like double checking and they're like, yeah we can do that. And I'm like, are you sure? Speaker 1 00:19:45 Are you sure? I know. And you feel like, you feel like you feel like Karen. Speaker 2 00:19:49 Yeah. Speaker 1 00:19:50 Like we have to be that horrible person and like Yeah Speaker 2 00:19:52 And it's so, it's so like cringe. You feel like you're the most difficult person in the restaurant cuz you're like that one person, he's like, it feels like you're so fussy but you're like I can't do anything about this. And then you're like, and he's real celiac so no like no cooking it and say no, no cross contamination, no anything. I Speaker 1 00:20:08 Know and we've been somewhere before and you say like, is the ice cream gluten free? And they'll check, so there's an education piece here because even plain vanilla ice cream you think why on earth would there be gluten in that? But sometimes it's produced in factories that contain gluten so if it doesn't say gluten-free on Speaker 2 00:20:24 And also the fla stand Speaker 1 00:20:25 Up. Yeah. Yeah. So they come out one restaurant to come out with a wafer completely gluten and put it in your ice cream and they went to just take the wafer out <laugh> and then you have to be like, no, no, gotta literally get her a clean bowl, clean scoop, clean ice cream and just dump that one. This is the level that we live at on a day-to-day basis. And you, you can can hear from Myla that like who is 11? Like you're still a child. I know you're so mature but you are ultimately still a child. Yeah. You get it. Yeah. So like why can't restaurants educate their staff? You know, as a business owner myself with the community pharmacy in Dublin, I know that it can be hard to cater for everyone, but the benefits to your business are so, so huge. So by providing gluten-free food properly, it's gonna give you a commercial advantage. Speaker 1 00:21:17 Celiacs all have a family and they have loads of friends and anytime they go out as part of a group in with their family or friends, any birthday parties, any big dinners, and I'm not just talking about kids, I'm talking about hen parties, I'm talking about 50th birthday parties. Every single family or friendship group occasion that involves one of the 50 plus thousand celiacs in Ireland, the celiac, which is is the decision maker. That is the ultimate thing. No matter who wants to go to what restaurant, unless the celiac can eat there, I'm telling you now they're not gonna go because the Celia, like the celiac is the one who calls the chef. Speaker 2 00:21:57 And then like, like if I've eaten something and I was like gluten, if I've eaten a meal or something, you kind of, well you're not gonna eat that again for a good bit. So for now I'm gonna stick to the restaurants then I haven't vomited after <laugh> just for now Speaker 1 00:22:11 <laugh>. Which is fair, it is the celiac in a group who is the decision maker they need to be catered for and the whole group will make their decision on where to eat based around that. It's really important to build customer trust and if an establishment has completed the training and has the accreditation from the Celiac Society of Ireland, then there will be more trust and it's no good just having a chef who has the knowledge. All of your staff need to have the knowledge. Ultimately it makes commercial sense to target the decision makers. So don't lose out and don't make celiac people lose out. You're catering for vegans, you're catering or vegetarians and I'm not having to go with either of those groups. I was a vegetarian for five years, but what I'm saying is avoiding gluten, while it is a lifestyle choice for some people it is literally a medical treatment for others. Ila, do you think that you would be happy to go out to a restaurant again soon? Speaker 2 00:23:07 Maybe ones that we know Speaker 1 00:23:09 Because we were talking about this thing. Would you go back to a restaurant if you'd been glutened? And I think that comes down to the communication you have afterwards with the restaurant owner. Speaker 2 00:23:18 Yeah, I wouldn't come back like just come straight back after not telling them what happened because they're just gonna do the same thing. So I obviously call the manager be a Karen and <laugh> if they like change the menu and they give their staff a bit more training on that area, I would go back because give everyone a second Speaker 1 00:23:35 Chance. You know, and a key thing here, what we want to hear from restaurants is that we're possible if they want to say that they're producing gluten-free food, they need to be able to, to dedicate a section of their food line only for gluten-free preparation. They need to put in a separate fryer for gluten-free food. If you're using oil to prepare it, you need to have separate utensils that you use with gluten-free food. It needs to be treated like it is poison, it cannot be anywhere near the gluten containing normal food. Your menu can of course contain options and a lot of places where we go and we'll return to, you know, they'll do gluten-free burgers and they'll cook all the burgers together in a gluten-free way. They, they actually don't contaminate any of the burgers and there's no point in cooking things twice. So just make it a rule that your burgers are all gluten free and then all you have to do is serve the normal burgers with a regular burger bun and have gluten-free burger buns in your freezer. At Speaker 2 00:24:37 Some restaurants we go to, they just have gluten-free bread and that's fine too cuz I don't, I'm not too fussy about the bread thats on top. Speaker 1 00:24:43 We're not divas. Yeah, that's one thing you can do. Having a bag of gluten-free pasta isn't difficult either. And just remember, you can use the same stainless steel pots once you give them a good scrub. It's only frying pans that need to have zero cross contamination and be dedicated to gluten-free food. Many celiac kids will be quite happy just to have a tiny little bit of oil or butter. But again, butter watch contamination and maybe a bit of cheese on their pasta. There you go. All of a sudden you've got two kids' meals. It's also very easy to put something like a bag of the ROS and gym, gluten-free chicken guan into the freezer and even just have some gluten free oven chips, McCain's two lovely ones, fyi. And have them in the freezer like we're not talking gourmet here, Speaker 2 00:25:35 We'll send, make your own pizza or whatever. Speaker 1 00:25:38 We didn't know about this stuff until we were taught, Speaker 2 00:25:40 So it's not actually anyone's fault who's serving you, they just need to get properly trained. All Speaker 1 00:25:45 Of the advice that you need to become a gluten-free, family-friendly or just gluten-free adult establishment is on the Celiac society website. But I think really out of what we want to say today is don't tell us that you're gluten free. If you're not, and if you're not sure then you're not gluten-free. Speaker 2 00:26:03 Then as I said before, I'd much rather you have nothing to eat then spend two hours throwing Speaker 1 00:26:09 Up. It's not just the two hours that you end up vomiting. Yeah. So what happens when you eat gluten to those little vili that we talked about earlier? Speaker 2 00:26:16 So after being all spread out, they go back in and they, Speaker 1 00:26:20 They get damaged again, don't they? They get damaged. Again, anytime that you're exposed to any level of gluten, then the veli can flatten and become less able to absorb minerals and nutrients. So isle here is obviously taking vitamins and particularly vitamin D. Osteoporosis can be a big problem in celiac. You're not having a negative impact on one person for a few hours. I think it's something like one crumb can do enough damage to prevent the correct absorption of nutrients from food for six months for celiac. Just have a think about that. It's not funny. I let you have been a wonderful podcast guest. It's been a pleasure. Thank you. <laugh> do come on again, but don't have another illness so that you know, you have to come on and talk about that. Yeah, stick with the one. Yeah. If you enjoyed this podcast and if you learned lots myself, Anil will be so, so, so grateful. If you could tag your local cafes and restaurant anywhere that is producing food, please tag them and encourage them to listen to this just so that they have an understanding of the impact that they can have on lives around them, within their community. Also, please do subscribe and follow this podcast because season four is launching next week and I am so, so excited about that. It's gonna be all about skincare and I'll tell you a lot more in detail about that during the trailer. Thank you so much for joining us. Bye.